Thoughts on how and when to change your routine.
The Squat, Deadlift, Bench Press, Press, Dips, Chin-ups/Pull-ups.
Slow-bulk or cut, put these exercises at the core of your workout program and you won’t go far wrong.
I’ve written two training options on this site. The question often arises, “Which should I use?” or, “When and how should I progress from one to the other?” Fair questions. Here’s a quick review of those two I’ve suggested:
1. “The Big 3 Routine“ Three days a week – Squat, Bench Press, Deadlift.
2. A “3-Day Split Routine“
- Monday – Deadlift, Chins
- Wednesday – Bench Press
- Friday – Squats
You will notice they are minimalistic so they are particularly suited for a cut. When cutting, to keep your muscle mass, think of things as quite simply “use it or lose it.” Keeping training volume low when cutting is important because of the body’s decreased recovery capacity while under maintenance calories. -If we overtax it, we won’t fully recover for the next workout, we’ll stress the central nervous system, increase our chances of getting sick, and miss training sessions.
Thus, the RPT rep pattern I feel is particularly suited for a cut as it allows for maximum muscle stimulation with low training volume. It can be used with any set of exercises.
When slow-bulking the difference in your routine might only be the addition of one or two a compound exercises and perhaps an accessory movement or two, as you’re able to handle more volume.
Big 3 or Split Routine, how do you know?
Whether a person should be doing the “Big 3″ every session or more of a spit routine depends entirely on recovery times. As Rippetoe said in his book “Practical Programming for Strength Training,” one of the most important things for determining what kind of program a person should be on, does not depend on the person’s lifting ability, but that person’s ability to for recovery.
Put another way, a person that can squat 1.5*body weight (1.5*BW) might recover quickly enough to make squatting 3 days a week possible, whereas another that can squat 1.0*BW may need several days to recover. He goes on to say that a coach cannot simply look at a person’s strength figures or body size and give them a program, they need to know their client’s capacity for recovery.
Are you Intermediate or Beginner? It depends on how you define it: Strength stats relative to body weight (links below) or, recovery capacity. Ideally we’d all keep our “beginners” recovery capacity well into the “intermediate” strength achievements range and we’d be able to train more and grow faster. But alas, the human body is rarely so kind.
It may be fun to choose a split routine because it’s “intermediate” and that makes you feel good, but if you could be making better gains on the “beginner” routine you’d be a fool to not do that. I assure you there are some very big boys and girls that use Rippetoe’s Starting Strength “beginner” routine.
As I am not with you in the gym, only you can tell what your recuperative abilities are. Generally the lower back is the weakest link in the chain. Are you physically able to recover if you do the big three barbell movements three days a week, or do your struggle with lower back pain? When your poundage progression stalls or you get lower back soreness that prevents you from having consistent workouts you know it’s time to change.
“Big 3″ to “Split Routine” – Ideas on Progression
A progression from the “Big 3″ to a split can be done in stages. When you start failing to recover then move onto the next step in the series. There are many different ways to slice an onion, here are my ideas on it.
1. Drop the Deadlifts, the most taxing exercise, back to Mondays only.
Monday – Deadlift, Bench Press, Squats
Wednesday – Squats, Bench Press
Friday – Squats, Bench Press
2. Drop the Squats to just Mondays and Fridays.
Monday – Deadlift, Bench Press, Squats
Wednesday – Bench Press
Friday – Squats, Bench Press
3. Drop the Squats to just Fridays.
Monday – Deadlift, Bench Press
Wednesday – Bench Press
Friday – Squats, Bench Press
You will notice that I have kept the Bench Press in there on all days. This is for example purposes only. The chest, shoulders and to a lesser extent the triceps, can become over trained like the lower back. If soreness in these areas keeps you from having a good workout then Bench Press work can be reduced in a similar fashion, in stages like with the above example with Squats and Deadlifts.
In general, a little soreness is fine. How do you know if you’re actually too sore to train and need to change your workouts or are just being a pussy? It’s difficult to judge. You’re always going to be sore to a degree somewhere in your body. You’ll become more attuned with your body in time but for now, as a general guide if after a good thorough general warm-up, joint warm-up and warm-up sets (guide to these in this article) you’re still really sore or the weight feels considerably heavier than normal then it may be time to change. This is one reason why it’s important to keep a workout log, so you know what you were lifting last time and know what you should be able to lift.
Finally
Strength coach Dan John proposes that people should expect 20% of all their workouts to be bad ones. For whatever the reason, this is what he has found with his coaching of athletes over many years. Before you switch things up, you need to make sure you didn’t just “have a bad one” but are genuinely in need of a change. So, if the weights feel unusually heavy one workout, or you’re extremely sore, listen to your body, stop your workout for that day and go home and rest. Sleep well. (Sleep, diet, and stress can all affect your gym performance.) Come back feeling refreshed, and then see what happens.
**********************************************
I believe that 70% of your results come down to your diet.
If your training has stagnated, often it’s not the training that needs to change. Have you got yours dialled in? Here’s my Step by Step Guide to using IF/ Leangains to get Ripped
**********************************************
Here’s some training links you might find useful:
- “The Big Three” Routine / “The Three Day Split RPT” Routine
- Starting Strength Instructional Videos: Main Page
Want to know where your strength ranks?
- Strength Standards (men and women)- by Martin Berkhan.
- Strength Standards for Women - Gubernatrix.co.uk
Comments/Questions welcome.
Andy, I know that you may not have an exact answer for this since all scenarios are different but do you have an average amount of time most people can continue with the Big 3 for three workouts per week before they need to start progressing to a split?
I think I’m going on about 7 months now and I’m starting to see strength stalls. So far I haven’t actually had to decrease weight significantly (only bench fluctuates ~5lbs week to week), so I don’t believe I’m losing muscle mass and I know on a cut if you are maintaining lifts then you are doing well. I’m just wondering if I’m at the point where I need to start moving towards a split. Should I wait until weight decreases significantly? It’s not a soreness issue (foam roller FTW) so I know my recovery is still there.
Sorry lots of questions with probably not much info to go on but any insight is appreciated!
Too many variables Michael. There is no single way to identify when one needs to change either, all needs to be looked at in context.
That’s what I figured. I was just hoping there was an easy indicator. I am hesitant to move to a split because I want to ride out the beginner gains as long as possible.
Hello Andy, a little question here
Currently on Stronglifts which as you may know assumes heavy lifting – squat in each workout, deadlifts and overhead press in workout A, while bench press pairs up with barbell rows or inverted rows on workout b. 3 times a week, proper recovery is really needed or else stalling occurs. Period.
I’m at ~15% body fat at the moment and started lean gains IF 10 days ago. I feel better, due to the carb cycle thing, yet dunno if the “cutting” method would bE best here or should I go body recomposition way?
1.82 and 77kg momentarily…. Underweight BMI wise!
Thanks a lot
That really depends on a few things, a recomp mainly on your level of advancement. Try it at a recomp level. Track your progress and adjust up or down based on your goal accordingly.
Andy,
I am currently on a cut, and have had pleasing results sticking to a three day split involving Bench, Chins, Squats, and Deadlifts and the occassional set of Dips; my question is twofold: if a dip station is unavailable, can bench dips be just as effective? Also, on the subject of Bench, I have had success with increasing weight gradually week by week, but have noticed with the increase in weight, that my shoulders are becoming obviously more taxed, is this a common occurence in regards to weight increase or is it a cause for concern regarding possible shoulder injury? What has been your experience, and how have you combated this issue? Have you at any point added supplemental shoulder excersizes?
Sorry for all the questions,
All the best,
Roman
Can bench dips be just as effective?
For weak people yes.
…cause for concern regarding possible shoulder injury?
Depends on form and any previous issues/personal flexibility and overall training volume vs recovery (diet + rest period)
The last question is too vague/ has too many possible scenarios.
Hi Andy, I have a follow-up.
When would you suggest to switch from bench dips to regular dips? For example, if I can make two-three regular dips, should I concentrate on increasing the reps or rather stick with bench dips until I would be able to do a couple of dozens of those?
When you can do a set of real dips for your target rep range, or when you get hold of some bands to assist you so that you can do real dips.
currently on a cut and this is my training regiment that i have been following:
Monday: Bench 3 sets, 4-6 reps. Dips 3 sets 5-7 reps
Wednesday: Squat 3 sets 4-6 reps. Shoulder Press 3X5
Saturday: Deads 2 sets 3-5 reps, Chins 3 sets 4-6 reps
Is this too much volume? Do I need to cut anything out?
That all depends.
All right, but depends on what exactly? loss in strength? if im getting sick?
Your recovery capacity, which is the main point of the article above.
I’ll give the article another read, thanks for the insight Andy
Andy, you state that if poundage progressions stall that it might be time to start changing to a split routine. You are familiar with my lifting stats from our assessments so far and I’ve slowly started to stop progressing on my lifts. However, I don’t have any lower back soreness so it “seems” that I’m recovering no problem but the poundage stalls seem to indicate otherwise.
I guess my question is how to judge if the poundage progression stall is just due to noob gains being fully maximized or if it’s really due to recovery. I know on a cut I shouldn’t expect to see too much increase in strength, but it’s just hard to accept that since I’ve been increasing steadily in the past few months.
Thanks!
Hi Michael, I need all the data for such a question and it’s not just a training question – everything is intertwined. Please wait for the reassessment.
Will do Andy… should I just continue with the Big 3 every session unless something goes horribly wrong until the next reassessment?
Yes as planned please.
*beginner
Hi Andy,
Great site! Can you tell me why you don’t include chin ups in the begginer rpt routine. Is this not critical to develop the upper back and biceps or do ‘the big 3′ hit these also?
No the other three will achieve that just fine.
Thanks for your response!
No worries.
Hey Andy, I understand that I am not a client and if this is asking too much then I won’t be offended if you do not reply.
My deadlift is lagging way behind my squat (Squat @ 295 3×5 Deadlift 255×3 (DL was at 290×3 at one point but form got shakey so I reset and my strength has gone down ever since)
Any programming tips to bring it back up? (or prioritize the DL) Also I attached 2 videos of my last deadlift session
W/U @ 225
Work @ 255*
*Now watching the video I realize that I was using a double overhand grip and should have probably used a mixed grip.
If it helps I’m 6 feet tall, weight around 180 and bench 210×3 / 190×8
Thanks again for making such an awesome resource.
-Chris
I’ve tried but the internet in my current location isn’t fast enough to load video. Sorry bud.
Its fine. You probably tried this but If you haven’t yet, you can lower the quality by pressing that “gear” looking button on the bottom left side.
-Chris
Great advice andy, thanks.
What if you are on a cut, do you think you are better sticking to a 3 day split, one exercise per day?
Also should you just concentrate on matching what you did last workout and not try to exceed it, even if you feel you can?
1. That depends on your recovery capacity. If you can do the big 3 then you should. It’s not one or the other. That’s the point of this article.
2. Always try and exceed what you did last workout if you can do so with good form. This isn’t going to be impossible with advanced lifters when cutting. However there is a whole grey zone of people out there that may or may not gain strength when cutting.
Why?
-Lifting status.
-Severity of deficit.
-Stupidity of previous diet.
-Change of workout plan. (Recovery..)
Oh this list goes on..
Hello Andy,
I have a question for you on weighted chins and tracking progression. Let’s assume I start a cut at body weight of 200#. (I’ll use 200# as it makes the math easy) Also assume I can do 5 chin-ups with 50# on a weighted belt. In this case the total weight “chinned” would be 250#. Now let’s say after a 12 week cut, I reduce my body weight to 170# and I can now do 5 chins with a 60# weighted belt. While the % of weight (relative to body weight) added has increased, the overall all weight “chinned” has decreased. (250# vs. 230#). Would this be indicative of a loss in strength?
Hello Andy, add
Adding to my question above. What prompted my inquiry was as I was reading the FAQ/Training Questions/#5 and #15, I started thinking about mechanical advantage. As you stated, during a cut, as you get leaner, the distance the bar has to travel (e.g. when benching) increases. However, with chins the distance traveled remains the same. In thinking about it last night, the same holds true if you’re doing weighted dips (in that the distance traveled stays the same). This question is more out of curiosity vs. anything else. As always, I welcome your input.
Fair enough. Not sure how much mechanics will come into play in this case. I see your logic.
Thanks Andy. As stated, it was more of a “hmmm, I wonder why….” sort of thought vs anything else. I’ll now get back to my fasting and lifting 8>). Take Care.
Can’t be sure Nick. Muscle loss? Very rare for all stats to remain the same with experienced lifters dieting for a long time. Look at things as a whole.
Hi Andy. Regarding the selection of days. People normally pick monday, wednesday and friday as training days. This leaves the weekend with two rest days. But if ones likes to eat like a pizza on weekends wouldn’t it be better to train tuesday, thursday and saturday/sunday? Kind of answering myself here. But just want to hear your comments!
/Vegard
Yes.
What if you want to eat pizza on weekend but already trained on monday, wednesday and friday this week?
Is it ok to add training on sunday and shift next week trainings one day to Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday to get back to Monday/Wed/Fri the week after?
Sure that works.
Or you could just eat the pizza and not worry about it on that day.
HI Andy, Great article. I have been doing IF for 8 weeks now, dropped fat from 24% to 10%. But i think im making some mistake, i dont know why cant i see my abs and my chest is still flabby and not in shape.sometimes it pisses me off. I train 3 days a week. I do basics like deadlifts,squats, benchpress, chinups and dips all of the 3 days and so do some extra shoulders, back and triceps if i get time. my current stats are bodyweight 71kg, lbm-60.80kg and bf-10%. training day macros-200-300p/200-300C/30-50F.
Rest day- 200-300P/50-100C/30-60F
Im still not ripped and some people say that i look skinner and i personally feel my arms are not growing from past 1 year. sometimes im lazy and eat some rice bubbles or cereals as my post workout, they are high in sugar, i dnt know if that sugar is ok for me or i should switch to some other carb foods. Will appreciate your advice.Keep up the good work
David, sorry mate but this question is too vague and general and could be any number of things. If you sometimes eat foods high in sugar it is not an issue.
Andy,
What are your thoughts on taking the occasional ‘full week off’ from training? If you feel it’s good to do, when do you think it should be done? Every 3 months or so? Just curious. Thanks.
This isn’t really my area mate. Better to seek an answer from Dan John, Rippetoe, Ferruggia, Defranco etc..
Hi Andy, thanks for directing me to this article. Doing squats & deadlift too much in one week has lead to overtraining/injury. My quads seem to need more recovery time. I need to space them out, and was thinking of the following routine. Do you think this looks okay in your opinion? RPT whilst on recomp macros:
Mon – Squat / Bench / Weighted chins
Weds – Deads / Overhead press / chins
Fri – Squat/ Bench / Wide grip pull ups
Not sure if I should bench every session or alternate with overhead press?
Was thinking of doing this for 10 weeks before re-assessing. Thanks for your help, Phil
Looks fine as it is Phil.
Hi Andy:
Question on training twice a week instead of three times a week for a cut. I estimate my BF at 9-10% and I’m on a straight cut. I’ve been training heavy weights every 3-4 days – basically twice a week, with a current target of +10% maintenance on training days and -35% maintenance on training days. My thought was, as long as I lift every few days, the more days I have a deficit, the more quickly the cut will work (and there have been some results so far) but is there a reason that 3 times a week (such as M/W/F as you outline) would be MORE effective for the cut, despite the fewer days with a caloric deficit? Thanks again.
Depends on a person’s training status and time commitments. You can argue either way for muscle preservation. The weekly calorie deficit will need to be kept constant and macros adjusted accordingly. I don’t usually use 2 days for clients, but that’s not saying that it doesn’t work.
Hi Andy,
I have been doing RPT now for 3 weeks after doing SS for 3 months. I feel RPT is working well for me however I find the additional reps hard work compared to SS. Maybe I just lack endurance, but I find myself pausing for 5-10 secs between reps especially towards the end of the set (on squat/deadlift, less so on bench). I feel that if I don’t wait I might fail the rep, at the very least compromise my form. I can still (eventually) manage all the reps with good form though and generally increase weight each week. Is this OK, or should I keep the weight the same until I can knock out the sets with no pause between reps? Thanks in advance.
p.s. great site
Hi James, good question. Basically you should try and keep things consistent when progressing with weight. To have a quick pause to get your breath is natural, 3-5 seconds even before the last rep of a set. However waiting for 10-15 seconds is a little successive and probably means you have gone up in weight a little quick. Try dropping back down. Unless you’ve always trained this way, then 10-15 seconds is fine. Consistency.
i have some questions and you might have some answers.
Firstly, judging from Layne Norton and some others, if overtraining is unlikely to append why switching from the big three to a split?
Secondly, won’t doing the big three only lead to imbalance (from a health point of view only such as shoulders health)?
Thanks in advance.
1. There are conflicting opinions on things to be found everywhere. Choose the advice of one person and stick to it.
2. No I don’t believe it does.
Andy,
Is it unhealthy to squat barefoot? I also do deadlifts barefoot. If it is not healthy, what cheaper shoes are good?
Thanks in advance
Not if you have the right amount of ankle mobility. Careful you don’t slip on the floor.
I would like to add that fitocracy helps to make a transition. Suppose you are logging big 3 and you got 1000 points for one workout. When switching to RPT you expect this to drop a little but not much, say, to 800 points not to 200 pts. That helps to figure out set weights and reps for transition.
Maybe one can just track the amount of kg “processed” during workout instead of fitocracy points and use the same principle here.
Track your strength. Trying to assess how good a workout was from “Fitocracy points” is ridiculous.
It’s not a question of tracking 5 rep max it’s more a helper tool for warmups in transition phase. You mean one should start the switch to RPT without any warm-up sets with his 5RM from the “big three”?
I’ve built a good deal of muscle using these essential compound movements, but my workouts also included a mixture of compound and isolation for specific muscles ( Traps, Medial deltoids, Posterior deltoids) . Are these compound movements alone enough to maintain muscle I’ve gained using other exercises?
I see many people have reported gaining strength during IF, which from my knowledge, is mostly related to nervous system adaptation. Is strength training, in regards to rep range, also enough to retain muscle I’ve gained using a 6-12 rep range?
1. Yes, definitely.
2. Yes, but you’d need to lift heavier than the weight you were using for the higher reps.
Andy,
Is it necessary to combine push and pull exercises? Right now I programmed my lifts and each day reall only focuses on push or pull. Is that a problem? Here is my current setup:
Mon: squats, press
Wed: bench, dips
Fri: squat, chins
Also I am currently on a slow bulk; since this is my first year barbell training would I be overtraining if I added Pendlay rows to Wednesday and some hamstring curls to Friday? Or am I hitting those muscles enough already. I am 153 pounds and squat 205 x 5, bench 185 X 5, dead 235 x 5. Strength of course is going uP every week…
Andy,
So right now I am on a slow bulk and created a routine similar to a split but with two squat days RPT. Here is an example of my workout
Mon- Squat (RPT), Press (PRT), Calf Work
Wed- Deads (RPT), Chins (RPT), Back/Bi Accessory work
Fri- Bench (RPT), Squat (RPT), Overhead Extenstions, Calf Work
I have a few questions requarding my workout plan….
1. When transitioning into a cut cycle, should I continue workout plan and drop or include accesory work? Or should I just switch to a “Big 3″ workout routine?
2. After I transition back into a slow bulk I was maybe thinking about changing things up and going from RPT to Beyond Brawn in terms of reps. Yet I am still unclear what ‘Beyond Brawn’ entails. Do I do the same amount of reps each set and if so, how many reps do I perform? and how many sets do I perform? And is this style of reps less intense on the CNS compared to RPT? Cause if so I will incorporate more accessory work…
**If it helps you to answer these questions, I am 5′ 10″ 152lbs 9%. My goal is to eventually get to 160lbs and maintain the same leaness as I am now. I have been training with barbells for about 7 months now after not lifting for about 2 years. I lifted since I was 18 and now 26yrs old.
1. On a cut your capacity to recover is reduced, thus you will cut things if anything.
2. There are no set rep numbers. Buy the book, it’s great.
Hi Andy.
I love doing squats and deadlifts but I hate bench presses (and I think I stuck at them). Judging from my macros after a session with you I think I’m on cut now. Should I consider split routine or rather keep doing big 3 for the next 6-9 months? I mean, I’ve been weightlifting for just a 6 months but lack of progress at bench press kinda bothers me.
Lack of progress with the bench while cutting is normal. Please see the FAQ for reasons.
Whether you need to switch depends on your recovery capacity and is usually governed by lower back/hamstring soreness.
Hi Andy, I’m interested in this issue too. I’m on a recomp (weight not decreased but squat, dl, chin and dip increased), but the lack of progress in bench press still bothers me. How did your bench press progress and do you have any tips to overcome this plateau?
Google this. Plenty of articles out there. But make sure you read that point on the FAQ first.
Ok thanks. I think I’ll stick with this routine then.
Why bench press is stalling? I mean why not any other lifts? Just because it’s the smallest excercise in terms of muscle volume?
See FAQ.
I read it. Sorry for bugging
All the best!
Hi Andy,
I’ve been reading a lot on German Volume Training. I know on a cut you and many advocate keeping the volume low. I just started my intermittent fasting this week “hoping to see great results”. I have tried GVT sporadically in the past (I must say I do not do 10×10 on squats, I would not walk for at least a week if I did.)
My question to you is what are your thoughts/experiences on GVT? Do you feel this would also be a decent program while intermittin fasting or am I way otta the box? I’m interested in more of a volume based program for a few reasons. 1. A few months ago I had a shot in my left shoulder for tendonitis. 2. Sparing my joints at the age of 36 and beyond is kinda important to me. 3. Strength is not as big of a priority as having an attractive body. I’m not joining any power lifting competitions in the near future that I can see. I feel any strength gains I get from adding weight to my lifts will be sufficient. Strength is not the main goal.
My GVT routine looks like this
Monday
Bench 10×10
Incline Bench 3×10-12
Seated rows 10×10
Lat pull down 3×10-12
Tuesday
Cardio – abs
Wednesday
Squat 3×10
Leg Press 3×10
Ham curl 3×10
Calf raise 3×10
Thursday
Cardio – abs
Friday
Dumbell Curls 10×10
Skull crusher 10×10
Shrugs 5x failure
Front raises 4×10
Side raises 4×10
If you’re cutting then you want to reduce volume. GVT is probably one of the highest volume routines out there.
Andy, just out of interest do you have any thoughts on combining low and high volume training on a bulk for both strength and hypertrophy? I know people like Dr Layne Norton who trains 5 days a week swear by it, but do you think it could still be suitable for using the IF 3 day a week cycle?
What is important is what works for you. Try it with 3 days carb up and try it with 5 days carb up.
Hey, how do you feel about the Starting Strength advanced novice program with reduced volume for people imbetween the Big 3 and the 3 day split on a cut? Possibly with RPT
Thanks,
Chris
Sure, try it. there’s no “one answer”.
I have been following LG since Jan 12′ which means I am 6 months into program. I have made some nice gains and great body recomp over this time. I have also been using a split routine which seems to be recommended by Berkham. Though I am confused because I see on your website you recommend that for the big 3 one should squat and deadlift the same day. I thought Berkham advised against such a routine. Should I continue my split or switch over to a big 3? I am currently 155 lbs and doing slow bulk up to 160. I bench 185×5, squat 195×5, DL 225×5, Dip BW+70×5, Chin BW+45×5. As you can see I have good strength for all my lifts but lacking in squat. Before I started LG I rarely trained BB due to l5s1 problmens but strong enough to do it now. I follow form based on rippetoe. So how should I go and format my workout? Continue split or go to more big 3 with focus on squat?
Jared, the whole message of the article is that there is no one size fits all for everyone. It depends on recovery, and for that you need to listen to your body.
Hi Andy,
I’m sorry to bother you but could you help me check my deadlift form again? I tried your tips to keep the neck neutral but i think the weight was too heavy so my neck shot straight up and my lower back rounded at the beginning of the pull. I thought of using more hip drive like you recommended. It felt much more powerful.
Thank you.
Yes you start and finish with a neutral spine but you don’t have it throughout the movement. Google “Mike Robertson Neutral Spine”.
Hi Andy. Great website! I’m new to LG and deadlift and squats (started for about 3 weeks) . I’ve been doing bench press n pull up not very consistently for about 2 years. I’m making great gains I think.
I’m 19, 1m70, 67kg and my stats are as follow
Chin: bw+12.5kg x 6
Dead: 90kg x 6
Squat: 67.5 x 5
bench press: 60 x 7
Would you mind to comment on my deadlift form?
By the way, if I feel good and no sore at all, can I add 2 squats 2 deadlift instead of 1 1 for 4 sessions? (i’m following your 3 day split routine. I’m planning to cut down a bit. I think I was eating less before I started LG, which is quite counter intuitive: i’m cutting and eating more! LG is really awesome!)
Thanks a lot!
1. Tuck your chin more to keep a neutral spine.
2. Thrust with the hips more.
If you’re doing a split rather than the big three though then stop. Do the big three. You’re weak with the potential to grow big and strong but you need to give yourself enough stimulus.
Hi Andy
1. Should I look a bit closer to my feet to keep my chin tucked more? Right now i’m looking on the floor about 3m in front of me
2. Thrust with the hip more means that my pulling up of the bar should be faster you mean?
3. If I do the big three, should I still follow the cut diet or do I have to eat more to meet the higher demand?
4. If I do the big three then where can I put the weighted chin?
Thanks for your quick reply!
1. Keep your chin tucked to keep a neutral spine. Google neutral spine if you don’t understand. Your eyes can move independently of the chin.
2. No, I mean more use of the hips thrusting. Imagine you’re screwing Angelina Jolie, hard.
3. The big three can be done on a cut.
4. You don’t.
I’m sorry to ask so many questions ><
3. I can do only ~10 chinup with my bw so I consider myself as beginner. What is your rationale behind not doing chin ups?
4. For beginners doing big 3, if these are the scenarios a) feel a bit of sore but still make poundage progress each training b) not feeling any soreness but stall in progress, is this time to consider switching to split routine?
Thank you mate. You helped me to clear up lots of thing about LG program! I have been quite obsessed with dieting and today I felt scared to see myself swallowing bread to meet the carb requirement today (although it's still short by 100gr)
The big three are enough stimulus because you are a beginner. Whether you are able to comprehend the reasons for that or not is irrelevant.
You said yourself you’re a beginner, and that tells me right there that you don’t need to consider a split routine.
Thank for the clarification Andy. I’m worrying too much I think. By the way, do you usually offer form critique through this blog or email? I will greatly appreciate your help.
Only clients, otherwise there simply wouldn’t be enough time in the day. Watching these videos and comparing with a video of yourself would be a good place to start for most though.
Branko, if you progress at pace it’s fine. But maybe you’ll have to vary the intensity of a set or an exercise..
Say for Chest,
Mon: Heavy Bench (3×6-8)
Wed: Weighted Dips (3×8-10)
Fri: Dumbell Incline (3×10-12
Hi again Andy-
Just a quick question about rep ranges. Was wondering what the difference is between 4-6 and 6-8 for the top set in RPT. Is it just whatever makes you happy? or is there more in it? Just a little confused as Scott chose to opt with 4-6 on his cut. Im thinking that going to 4-6 like Scott would lower volume, but still keep the intensity. Or does it just come down to your recovery and personal choice?
Thanks in advance mate!
Generally lower for strength, higher for size. Deadlifts work better with a slightly lower rep range to the rest as they are far more demanding.
Thanks for the clearing that up for me, very helpful!
No worries Jimmy!
Hey Andy, hope all is well.
I’m doing your recommended 6-8, 8-10, 10-12 RPT layout and I hit 200lbs on my squat on my 2nd workout of last week. My quads were super sore and I definitely felt the DOMS. I haven’t had DOMS prior to this, as my squat just kept going up with no problems. My last workout of last week (3rd workout) I hit 205lbs for 8 reps (PR) but I felt sharp pains on that set. Actually, I started feeling a less intense form of that pain in my warmup sets. Then when i went for 185 for 10 reps I was grinding them out the whole time. My legs were shot and I could not even begin my 3rd set so I just went into Bench Presses. I am going to go back and try to complete those poundages today. If the pain persists, however, should I scale back down to 4-6, etc. or maybe drop squats to 2x a week? In Rippetoe’s SS he has you do a total of 15 squats per workout. I’ve been doing 30 per workout 3x a week. Could it be too much volume for me? What are your thoughts? Thanks a bunch!
I really want to hit my workout today though. I just had a little chicken and rice and a glass of milk so I’m definitely ready to hit it hard today lol
“Sharp pain” -> Have someone check your form. If fine, see a sports doctor or specialist physio. Pain from training yes, but shouldn’t ever be sharp.
Maybe “sharp” isn’t the right word. It feels like DOMS. You know when it’s difficult to get up out of a chair because your legs are sore. Don’t you feel a pain in your quads getting up? It feels just like that. Only when coming upur of the bottom of the squat. Is it just regular soreness that I should push through? I’ve posted form checks on starting strength forum. I’ll do it again. But what do you think Andy?
The forum is your best bet for a wider range of opinion. I don’t have pains like that when squatting once warmed up, even with DOMS.
Where would you add in Olympic lifting into this?
That would depend what lift it was, what your goals are, what volume you’d be training that lift with, and how your recovery capacity is. -In other words very difficult to answer.
Hi Andy,
Following my exams I’ve been studying Stuart McRobert’s brilliant book Beyond Brawn. Considering following Stuart’s guidelines whilst doing Intermittent Fasting, I had the following question;
Have you used micro-loading yourself? If so, do you have any general thoughts about it? Did you gain well on it?
Micro loading and RPT are not mutually exclusive systems, even an advanced trainee often when slow-bulking will be able to do both. This is the goal -increase in poundage every workout where possible.
im doing a rpt-style of program that goes like this :
day 1. bench , db bench , dips
day 2.deads ,chinups . pendlay rows
day 3. military press barbell and db + upright rows
day 4 squats , good morning and legpresses .
i alternate these workouts on a mon wed fri .
regards branko
For anyone reading:
1.) Volume is high. 2.)Deadlifts and Squats are less than once a week.
Conclusion we can draw? Slightly more advanced, non-cutting routine.
Thanks for sharing Branko.
if on a cut what changes would you recommend ill do with this routine ?
cheers branko
Whatever changes you see fit along the guidelines written mate. There’s nothing set in stone except that less volume is more.
got you ! but as i see this .. its already low in volume on each day im doing only between 6-9 total sets for each muscle group to me that is low ?
if i were a client of yours and i was on a cut what changes would you suggest ?
cheers mate !
To me that is high when on a cut.
Hi- I’m doing the split routine, and I’m wondering how tired I should be after workouts. I do the exact workout recommended by Martin Berhan in his recent fuckarounditis article (3 sets of about 5-7 reps for BP, DL, SQ) and I definitely hit exhaustion in every set at the right rep number, such that I don’t have any reps left in me to do. But when I’ve completed all 3 sets, after a short rest, I feel like I could do another set or two. Should I? Or am I perhaps doing something wrong, such that I’m not as wiped as I should be? Should I switch to Big 3? I’ve only been weight lifting a few mos., but I’m a slow recover-er, so I figured this would be the right approach. Until last week, I was doing 2 days of multiple exercises (lunges, squats, rows, flys).
Yes this is usual. The goal is not to train yourself into the ground, but to lift the weight that you planned to do before you set foot in the gym and then get out. Adding extra exercises that bring little to the table is a very common mistake and can lead to overtraining, especially when on a cut.
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Great article, as always
Great timing, great article, thx.
When I started the lean gains 4 months ago i decided to go with a 3 day split as I was doing 4 or 5 days a week programs, so I wanted something hard but no as often. Initially I was making progress on all exercises, but after 3 months I got stucked with squats, presses, pull-ups and chin-ups. For some reason I was still able to make progress with dead-lift and dumbbell bench press. I noticed as the dead-lift was my first exercises in the week that extra one rep would make all the exercises suffer. I wonder if this means not enough recovery? Anyway, I decided to take one week off and restart. Also, many times I see Martin Berkhan talking about working out every 4,5 days due to lack of time. Such a routine was not recommended here, but I am curious how this would compare to typical 3 day split? I assume all would depend on recovery time, but what if we just give that extra time to recover and see what happens then.
All depends on recovery time.
love the article! this one is awesome! still loving my program, thanks andy!
Good guideline article Andy!
I’m far from at the point where I would need to switch at the moment, but I’ll make sure to come back to this one when it’s time
Awesome article, Andy! It’s actually what I needed to read!
I’m on a cut and I’m doing The Big 3, adding chinups (still not RPT style)
Recently, it’s difficult to progress because I’m doing 130 kg DL and 155 kg SQUAT.
I was thinking to change the routine, and I will be like this:
Monday – DL, BP, chinups
Wednesday – SQ, BP, chinups
Friday – SQ, BP, chinups
What do you think?
I left SQ off on Monday ’cause DL take lots of effort, or should I keep the SQ everyday? Thank you in advance!
Sergio glad you like it. Seems you missed the point of the article though which was, “try it and see.” -There’s no one answer.
Great Article Andy!
“Put another way, a person that can squat 1.5*body weight (1.5*BW) might recover quickly enough to make squatting 3 days a week possible, whereas another that can squat 1.0*BW may need several days to recover.”
I just had this experience this week. Did squats at 1.2*BW and have been sore for the past 3-4 days. Looks like it’s time to change it up.
Possibly.